A few days ago, we toured the Holocaust Museum in Washington D.C., and even though I have been aware of the terrible events of that time almost all of my life, nothing ever brought home the sheer immensity of the horror like that visit did.

As we saw one exhibit after another of the depravity that the Nazis showed towards not only the Jewish people, but also toward gypsies, the mentally and physically challenged, Communists, Socialists, Jehovah’s Witnesses, and others, one thought continually occupied my mind – why didn’t they fight back?

At least six million human beings perished to satisfy Adolf Hitler’s crazed bloodlust. Except for a few isolated incidents where the doomed fought back, most seemed to quietly allow themselves to be transported to the Nazi death camps, like lambs to the slaughter. Why?

Please don’t misunderstand, I am not condemning the actions of those who were the victims of the Holocaust in any way. Walking through that museum, I had tears in my eyes and my heart ached. But I just do not understand how anybody could just stand there and wait their turn. Was it apathy? Ignorance? Cowardice? An “It can’t happen to me” mentality? I don’t know, and I don’t understand.

There were a few who fought back. During the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising of 1943, Jewish resistance fighters armed with a few guns and makeshift weapons such as gasoline bombs, pitchforks, and rocks attacked the German soldiers who attempted to move the ghetto’s residents to the notorious Treblinka death camp.

For nearly a month, the Jews held out against the overwhelming numbers of well armed Nazi troops, and though they were eventually crushed, they bought another month of life for many of their people, and they made the Nazis pay  a  very heavy price.

Some will argue that the uprising didn’t accomplish anything, because the Nazis won, and still exterminated the Warsaw Jews. But I can’t help but wonder what would have happened if the Jews, the gypsies, the Socialists and all of the other victims of the Holocaust would have resisted. Would the course of history have been changed?

I knew an old Jewish man who wore the tattoo of a concentration camp survivor on his arm, and he told me that his parents, sister, and brothers had all died at the hands of the Nazis. I asked him the same question back then – why hadn’t they resisted? He said that he was only 12 years old when they came for his family, and that his older brother had wanted to fight back, but that their father said “No, if we do that, it will only make things worse. It’s too big a problem for any one person to fight. If we cooperate and just try to get along, who knows, we may have a chance.”

Then I look at what’s happening in our own country. How many of us complain about the direction our nation has gone, but seem to have that same apathy?  How many think that our problems are too big to change? How many of us think that if we just let things happen around us, if we just go with the flow, maybe things will get better?

How’d that work out for the Jewish people?

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33 Comments on Why Didn’t They Resist?

  1. John Pontsler says:

    Nick, you are and were a newspaperman. What was the media of the time saying about what was going on? Were the people of Germany and Europe giving a pass the the political leaders of their time? What road is America traveling? Are we doomed to re-enact the same mistakes, because we are not questioning the prommises and agenda of our leaders? Are we not getting the truth from the people who have supposedly taken the job of watchman on the wall?

    I too have had friends who wore the mark of the Nazi’s on their wrist. Unfortunatily I believe that because of “we the People”s complacency we may be doomed to suffer a similar fate. When you become a target of the most powerful government in the world simply because you voice an opposing point of view it creates a very chilling atmosphere. When the government minamizes the views of loyal americans, it may be past time to reveiw just what our declaration of independence regarding such tyrants: “But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.”


  2. MichaelG says:

    Godwin’s Law of Internet debate — anyone who compares a situation to the Holocaust loses the argument. It’s just too over the top.

    The thing that amuses me is that everyone wants to put their case in the starkest terms, and no one wants to think about the actual issues. There is a lot of thoughtful stuff on the net, but most of it is just chest pounding. Too bad.

    The Tea Party is the latest example. Lots of angry slogans, almost nothing in the way of thoughtful analysis, and no solutions. They will end up as cannon fodder for the usual political groups. Because they can’t be bothered to think about the issues or become informed, they are easily misled.

  3. Paul Zeller says:

    All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. – Edmund Burke

  4. concerned in texas says:

    For once Michael G makes a good point.

  5. Although it requires getting past Godwin’s Law; the Nazi rise to power and Hitler’s insane and almost unbelievable control over Germany holds many lessons for future generations to remember and learn from.

    Among other things Hitler blamed an international Jewish conspiracy and their control of banking for many of Germany’s problems. He said Germany needed a strong government to control society and eliminate undesirable elements. Propaganda and vilification of any opposition were pervasive. Opposing parties were deemed not valid and made illegal. Opposing press was called illegitimate. Youth were indoctrinated in the education system. We all learned this in history class, right?

  6. @ MichaelG: That’s so true. “Because they can’t be bothered to think about the issues or become informed, they are easily misled.”

    I see this among people of all political persuasions (and I have been guilty of it myself). We latch on to a position or belief and then fail to listen to and consider facts and evidence to the contrary.

  7. Bess Weber says:

    Compare Hitlers history from childhood on then put the Obama history along side & be amazed at the similarity to the present president & his agenda and also the plans for the future of America. Or LACK OF A FUTURE AS WE HAVE KNOWN IT.
    And Michael G you need to open your eyes The Tea Party DOES have answers and are thinkers ,sounds like you have been listening to the LIBERAL MEDA . We want to take back America and have We the people be in charge but too many Americans, illegals , people who want the Government to give them every thing for nothing,get off you butts and get a job any job take responsibility for your self & your family take charge of your health, take an interest in your children’s education,the text books stc,Wake UP AMERICA!!!

  8. Dale says:

    Are you aware of how many Jews did fight back in many different ways? Have you ever seen “Dare to Resist” on PBS? Our Aunt was one of three women profiled, women who fought back. Our Aunt worked in the Hungarian underground until she was turned in and when in Auschwitz, worked at saving additional lives.

    She said she survived only because the war ended when it did. After the war, she was eventually granted permission to migrate to Palestine and when she lived in Israel she fought in the Israeli army, not because she was a Zionist but because she felt that Jews needed a place to go where they could be free from persecution (like what had happened in Europe).

    Read and listen and learn from the Shoah Project done by Stephen Spielberg who was determined that history be recorded in the hopes that history would not be doomed to repeat itself.

    So, now, in our country, we hear about how this is a Christian Nation and no other religions are welcome and we hear this from a very large minority. There are evangelicals who believe that Catholics are not true believers because of their belief in the Virgin Mary. Our Supreme Court has declared that corporations are “individuals” in terms of being able to donate to the political process. The man who killed the guard at the Holocaust Museum believed that Pres. Obama was being led by his Jewish handlers.

    Whenever external circumstances are not optimum, people look for scapegoats for their misery and again, this is happening. In Germany too many people were led by fear when their economy was faltering, permitting the Nazis to lead by fear and intimidation. There were many wonderful people who stepped up and despite the threat to themselves, saved thousands of lives (e.g. Schindler’s List).

    Pres. Roosevelt and his advisor, Joseph Kennedy, turned away Jews by not permitting their ships to land in our country. This country did not care either. And the Jews are criticized for trying to protect their own in Israel.

    I do not agree with aggression for it’s own sake, but really learn about what is going on the Middle East and not just listen to the “news” reports. The Arab cultural norms do not match ours and we should not be viewing their actions through our eyes, but we must learn to walk in their shoes to truly learn what is going on and why Israel takes the actions it does (and note I do not always agree with Israel’s policies either).

    To compare what happened in the Holocaust to what’s going on today is truly dangerous – look at the article in Time magazine about the militias in this country and the fact that they are determined to take matters in their own hands to protect our country – by violence!

    To do something – fight prejudice. Ignorance is expensive! Work at seeing that our schools are improved so that people can be motivated by confidence and not fear and can learn to understand and accept the differences among people and thrive on it, not be threatened by it.

  9. Frank Serrao says:

    History is repeating itself right here in America with the murder (yes murder) of the most innocent of human lives through abortion. Like the Nazis we justify our barbaric thinking by claiming its not a human being, its a “fetus”. We just re-define when life begins and we have a license to kill. Isn’t that convenient. We forget that that the heart of the fetus is beating and that it even has fingerprints. Life begins at conception not at childbirth (otherwise you would also have to say that 5 minutes before a child is born it is not a human being). Its worst tolocaust because millions more are being slaughtered daily and we look the other way, just like the Germans did. And we condemn them??? We are a sad species of hipocrits.

  10. Frank Serrao says:

    History is repeating itself right here in America with the murder (yes murder) of the most innocent of human lives through abortion. Like the Nazis we justify our barbaric thinking by claiming its not a human being, its a “fetus”. We just re-define when life begins and we have a license to kill. Isn’t that convenient. We forget that that the heart of the fetus is beating and that it even has fingerprints. Life begins at conception not at childbirth (otherwise you would also have to say that 5 minutes before a child is born it is not a human being). Its worst than the holocaust because millions more are being slaughtered daily and we look the other way, just like the Germans did. And we condemn them??? We are a sad species of hipocrits.

  11. Dale says:

    To Bess Weber: Hitler’s upbringing in no way matches that of Pres. Obama.

    Learn your history: The Constitution did not grant all of the “rights” folks claim, e.g. voting. Women did not vote and men who were not property owners did not vote. Blacks were 3/5 of a person.

    Media is not just liberal. Seems folks who are educated are considered too liberal by many. And next time you listen to Fox, do fact checking. Next time you listen to Tea Party candidates, do fact checking. They are so comfortable in denying things that they’ve said on the record previously. No, they don’t say they’ve changed their mind due to a change in circumstances, they just claim they never said it.

    Your grammar (and lack thereof) show a lot of anger! Be free to leave the grid and not use any of the privileges we have in this country – you can refuse to accept Social Security and Medicare. You can refuse medical assistance because medicines and/or medical procedures were created by “liberals.”

    I feel very threatened by folks as you show yourself here – so angry that they cannot see past their anger.

    Again, please educate yourself,

  12. Paul Stough says:

    So Bess, do you believe that Hitler was born in Kenya of a Kenyan father and an American mother, and raised in the Muslim religion, and had a “Kenyan anti-colonial” world view?

    Joseph Goebbels would be proud of the work that people like yourself, Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Glen Beck, Newt Gingrich, and Ann Coulter are doing to demonize Democrats/Liberals just the way Goebbels demonized the Jews and other groups in Germany which paved the way for the otherwise average German to murder millions of innocent people, or at least allow it to happen.

    Is that what you want to happen to the Democrats/Liberals in this country? Do you think President Obama and the Democrats/Liberals are less human than you?

    I understand the frustration that members of the Tea Party feel; the problem is that their frustrations are misguided.

    More later


  13. Paul Stough says:

    Frank; So if you believe that abortion is murder, do you also believe that the woman who has an abortion is a murderer, and therefore should be either put to death or suffer life in prison?

    I would like to know how many votes any politician who espoused that view would get, but if you believe that abortion is murder, then you must believe that the woman is a murderer.

    That is why nothing is done to stop abortion.


  14. Dave B. says:

    Dale makes many good intelligent points. I think that there was a lot of resistance by the Jewish people. We just don’t understand the situation they were in at the time. They didn’t have the weapons or power that the Nazi’s had. What gets me is the German people that now try to say that the holocaust never happened! It is their legacy that they now must live with and they don’t like it. When Gen. Eisenhower first saw a concentration camp he was sickened. He then was so angered that he made the entire townspeople who lived nearby, tour the camp. And the people claimed they knew nothing! We should not wonder why the Jewish people didn’t resist more but rather why the German people didn’t resist what the Nazi’s were doing.

  15. Paul Stough says:

    Dale; the main reason the German people didnt resist is that they had listened way too much to Joseph Goebbels and his anti-Jewish propaganda, and were convinced that the Jews and other groups were less human than the Germans and therefore didnt deserve to be treated like humans, just like slave owners did with their slaves, and many Republicans believe about Democrats/Liberals.

    The problem is that many Republicans dont even recognize how much they hate Democrats/Liberals, but you can sure tell it by what they say, such as Bess comparing President Obama to Hitler.


  16. Carey McConnell says:

    Wow! Both sides represented. This has been the most refreshing Bad Nick response I’ve ever read, for its equal treatment of nearly all sides.

    I just have one thing to add: Obama is not Hitler, he does not want to take over private enterprise and make it part of the government, he does not want to bring the US into Sharia law, he does not want your guns. These accusations are not only baseless, they are downright rediculous.

    The funniest thing I’ve heard Glenn Beck say was that he knows Socialism is bad because he read about it in a free book from the library. Get it? If you don’t, you may be a tea drinker.

  17. Frank Serrao says:

    Paul: Yes, women who have abortions have consented, knowingly or unknowingly, to the murder of their babies. Society has deluded many of them into believing it is alright and has raised this act of murder to the level of law (much as it was in Nazi Germany). This is wrong. This country cannot mete out a punishment for something it has legalized, even though its evil. But God can mete out a punishment on Judgement Day. Whether something is popular or not has nothing to do with good or evil, or right or wrong. People who vote for elected officials (like John Kerry and Nancy Pelosi) share in the guilt and have the b

  18. Paul Stough says:

    Frank; what is the difference between voting for someone who supports abortion rights, and voting for someone who opposes abortion rights, but then does nothing about it after being elected?

    For the first six years of GW’s Presidency, the Republicans controlled the White House and the Congress, and could have passed and signed any law they wished making abortion illegal, but they chose not to. Tell me why?

    I have never seen a proposed law making abortion illegal that provided for any punishment for the woman who had the abortion.

    If the woman hasnt done anything illegal, then why would anyone believe that anyone else involved in the abortion has done anything illegal?

    Both sides simply use the abortion issue to raise funds.


  19. Dale says:

    To Paul: Sorry, I can’t agree. Sorry you never met our Aunt. Also, our Uncle (different side of the family) fought the Germans in the French underground. I have never heard that Jews thought they were lesser or deserved less. Remember, Jews had already suffered through centuries of persecution.

    And to Dave: Thank you for your response. The sad part is that revisionist history is still being written today in our country. There are many who say the holocaust never happened and there are many trying to change the facts of history in this country. E.G., the change to textbooks in Texas.

  20. Paul Stough says:

    Dale; Sorry, I must not have made myself clear. I dont believe that the Jews and other persecuted groups thought of themselves as lesser humans and deserved less, but what I was trying to say is that the Germans were taught, and many came to believe, that the Jews and other persecuted groups were less human than the Germans.


  21. Lots of good responses here as noted above. We seem to have lost the thread of the original question though, which was: Why didn’t they resist?

    A partial answer to that question is that as an oppressed minority they were unable to resist. The majority would not help due to the position of the Jews as the “other”.

    All societies need the “other” as a scapegoat. The Jew has served that purpose in many societies over the centuries. In the US today the role of the “other” is filled by Muslims and Hispanic immigrants (illegal or otherwise).

    Fortunately for us, our laws and our government serve to protect the “other”. When the government begins to use the “other” as a scapegoat for societies problems, then they have no protection as the general populace will offer no protection at all.

    Thank God for our court system, which protects the rights of ALL individuals, not just the favored few. And thank you to George W. Bush (for whom I generally have nothing but contempt) for preventing the demonization of our Muslim population during his time in office. The loss of his influence in this situation is becoming strikingly apparent.

    If one were to study the attitudes of the general populace of Germany in the thirties I think you would find a strong likeness to the call to “Take our country back” and a similar jingoistic attitude that the rest of the world does not respect us for being the best.

    Oh, and a question for Bess Weber: What color is the sky in your world?

  22. Frank Serrao says:

    Paul: During the Bush years partial birth abortion was not allowed. Also Bush did appoint two very strong opponents to the Supreme Court who were pro-life. The problem right now is that the Supreme Court needs to reverse the 1973 Roe vs. Wade decision which legalized abortion. Congress cannot reverse this.
    It has to be done by the high Court. The Courts ruling on Roe vs. Wade was not constitutional. No where in the constitution is abortion permitted. It is an example of the court legislating its own political agenda from the bench without any consitutional basis to support it. The Constiution guarantees “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness” to all.
    That includes the unborn because they are human beings too.
    The problem is more in the High Court than Congress. We need to elect God-fearing public officials who believe in one nation UNDER God as our forefathers intended.

    As to your other question, we know abortion is murder. We just skirt the fact for our own convenience. The guilt is not only on the perpetrators (doctors, etc.) but also on those who vote for elected officials who are for abortion. Like Pilate you cannot wash your hands of this crime. It will follow you into eternity.

  23. Dale says:

    To Frank: Of course abortion is not in the constitution. The constitution has been enriched by interpretation throughout the years which is why our country has thrived. Nothing that stays static can succeed. Remember also that medicine was not an advanced science at that time.

    Our forefathers did not intend that our country should be led by God fearing individuals. Our forefathers believed in separation of church and state.

    I challenge your belief structure that our government must be run by Christians and I further challenge your linking of abortion and the Holocaust.

    Ignorance is expensive; education is the only way this country will survive strong and healthy. Suppression brings us back to the ways of governments like that in Germany that brought about the Holocaust and I, as well as many others, will fight this intolerance in any way possible.

  24. Allan says:

    I served in the military with a man whose parents had survived their stay in a German consentration camp. His father was a Christian pastor that did not agree with what Hitler was doing to the Jews and had tried to help them. He and his wife did not oppose Hitler with force but refused to submit to his will. They paid a price for their stance like many others that we never hear about.
    I don’t intend on standing by and see our country destoyed from within. Some would try to make people think that liberals are intelligent and conservatives are not and that just is not true. Many people wanted change in the last election and that is exactly what the country got. We are now ready for a change from what we have experienced the last two years.

  25. Roger says:

    Why didn’t they Resist?
    They were not willing to think for themselves and wanted someone else to blame so they decided to listened to the Propagandists even though the Propaganda could not stand up to the light of day or honest open debate. Germans burned the books that didn’t follow the approved party line. Have we heard anything in the news about burning books here in the US?

    How different is burning books, which is just an attempt to stifle ideas that you don’t understand, from shouting down people who want to express a different view point?

    I would be very surprised if a version of “take our country back” was not a slogan used in the 1930’s in Germany.

    Take the country back from the non-blond. Take it back from the Jew. Take it back from Gypsies, the foreigners.

    If all the victims heard all the time was that they were the problem, I think they eventually came to believe it themselves.

    The victims did not resist and the Germans chose to close their eyes to what was happening with a vocal minority wresting control of their country based on hollow slogans.

  26. Angie Manson says:

    Frank, why do you feel the need to inject your religious view of reality into a blog that had absolutely nothing to do with your chosen topic? This blog was about the Holocaust, and the Jews response to it, not about abortion.

    Where do you stand on abortion when the mother’s life is in danger? Or if it is a pregnancy that resulted from rape or incest? What if your wife or daughter was possibly going to die if she didn’t have an abortion? Would you tell them to do so, because it’s your God’s will? Do you have an opinion of your own, or do you just repeat whatever nonsense prattle the Pope and the Vatican put out? Methinks the latter.

  27. T & R Martin says:

    To Dale, Re: Comment to Bess Weber.
    Surely Dale you did not mean to be so insulting to Ms. Weber as you came off sounding very condescending. Perhaps typing is not her bag, but she knows what is in her heart. She may remember a time in America when she felt safe & could not imagine civilians would ever be attacked here or that people in government would openly admit they were communist. Some people don’t realize that those who are referred to as “Tea Partiers” are just ordinary American citizens worried about the debt we are passing on to our children & all future generations. They are not organized as in a party. There is also a group called the “Tea Party Express” & I believe that group is organized. Of course our president is not like Hitler, but I do not believe he is on the right road for America—in fact, I do not know if any one person can right the wrongs that have happened over the years. I am tired of hearing people say if you do not agree with our president you are prejudiced. So Dale, no need for you to feel threatened by Bess.
    P.S. Who knew liberals were so much more educated than conservatives? I learn something new every day!

  28. Frank Serrao says:


    Abortion is still the taking of a human life. You can’t choose between one life and another. An effort should be made to save both. But you cannot willfully end one life simply because another life is “in danger”. That is something all women accept as a risk of pregnancy. If they aren’t willing to accept the risk they shouldn’t expose themselves to the possibility of pregnancy. Life is a gift from God and must never be marginalized. “Thou Shalt Not Kill” means what is says.


    We are a Jedeo-Christian society. Please tell me one place in the Constitution that provides for separation of Church and State. There isn’t any. They specificially declared us to be “one nation under God”. These are not my words but theirs.
    Does that sound like separation of Church and State to you. Duh!
    It can’t be clearer than that. Also the Constitution doesn’t just evolve from anybody who wishes to change it to suit their own agendas. It is a living document and provides for legal means of changing it (through ratification by the States, etc.). No where is the Supreme Court allowed to change it as time permits. They are charged with ONLY interpreting it as it was written and legally amended over the years.

  29. Dale says:

    To T&R:

    I lost people I knew in the 9/11 attacks, so please don’t assume that I am not aware of what is going on or don’t remember feeling safe. (We lived on L.I. at that time and L.I. was completely cut off from the mainland because all bridges and roads into NYC were cut off.)

    My comments were meant to show that education is important in the process of running our country. An education permits you to look further than just what a television show says and, in my mind, a lack of education is often linked with those most victimized by economic downturns. Are you aware that after pay back of loans made by the government to the car companies and banks, which pay back includes interest and increased value of stocks, that the actual amount of stimulus spending is not in the trillions, but less than 50 Billion? The money spent on stimulus saved thousands of jobs in education, police and fire fighting – services that enhance quality of life and are life saving. Many economists have come forward to say that spending should not be cut – that’s what was done after the 1929 crash and this country went into a depression. Is that what people really want? Why should 25% of the wealth of this country be held by less than 1% of the population? This is exactly what happened both in 1928 and 2007 (crashes occurring in 1929 and 2008). If the middle class is not permitted to earn enough to spend, which occurred both times, then the economy falters. I don’t see the “rich” spending money to help those who have lost jobs because of the economy.

    I am very well aware of the Tea Partiers and their views and although I am not a Tea Party person, some of my views are not dissimilar. And no, despite your assumption, I am not a Liberal.

    And, yes, being Jewish, I do feel threatened by people such as Bess (although I do not claim that Bess feels this way) who believe that only Christianity is the right way. I’m tired of being told I’m going to hell because I am not a true believer. I am tired of Tea Party folks who can only shout others down. Many Tea Party folks want to legislate morality. Okay, so how do you enforce such legislation with a smaller government, which is also what is advocated?

    Many people are threatened by our President’s race, but I do agree that disagreeing with our President does not automatically mean a person is prejudiced and I think that political correctness has gone too far in far too many instances.

    And, your P.S. was, in my eyes, sarcastic and offensive. The originators of the Conservative movement were quite intelligent (e.g. William Buckley and Pres. Reagan).

  30. Marnin says:

    To Frank S.
    Did you ever hear of “The Bill of Rights?” Last time I looked it was part of the constitution as has all the succeeding Amendments. The First Amendment specifies “Freedom of Religion.” I do not define this as a mandate for our country to be led by Religious Right Wing Fanatics who can only see their religion as the “right one.”

  31. Frank Serrao says:


    Nobody’s talking here about one religion running the country. Thats what happened in England and what the colonists wanted to get away from. Hence you have freedom of religion in the Bill of Rights. I don’t know where you got your interpretation from but we are talking about apples and you are talking about coconuts. Freedom of religion does not mean separation of Church and State. It means you’re free to practice the religion of your choice. Everybody agrees on that. But there is no where in the Constition that says there should be separation of Church and State. That is a different matter altogether. The Bill of Rights doesn’t say it either. Our founders declared “ONE NATION UNDER GOD”. That is what they intended and that is what they meant.

  32. Marnin says:

    Yes and which interpretation of “G-d.”
    Maybe we should have the Mormons in control, or maybe the Jehovah Witness, or maybe the Amish, or maybe the Christian Right, or maybe the southern Baptist or which of the other Christian interpretations of the way we should live. That is why there should be a separation of Church and state. One groups views are different from each other. That is why the Christian Religion has splintered into so many different groups. That is why England split from the Church in Italy and formed their own Church. That is why so many different groups left Europe to come to America. One size does not fit all and that is what you and others are talking about. Whose “G-d” should run our government? How much “freedom” will all the other religions really have when one religious group takes control, especially if that group is one that feels theirs is the one “true” religion. Let’s keep religion where it belongs, in our hearts and in our Churches, Temples and Mosques. Live by your religious beliefs and inspire your children to live the same way but don’t foster your views on others. There is no right or wrong way to believe in G-d. unfortunately too many wars have been fought in the name of G-d when religion governs the government.

  33. Penny says:

    If abortion is made illegal, then the back street abortionists will have a field day, and many women will die in their hands.

    It would be like Prohibition, isn’t it better to have it out in the open and have abortions in sanitary conditions?

    I am not pro-abortion, but I can see the consequences if it is made illegal.

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